Boy oh boy, I have daygamed in Western Europe, but Athens has been by far the most unique experience. Read my prior post on my thoughts on how social trust affects daygame. That post is the social/sciency cornerstone of this article.
The main struggle in Athens has to be maintaining your vibe. The main challenges are as follows:
- Lack of manners from locals and tourists
- Pestering street vendors (especially in Ermou street)
- Variety of approach responses, as demographics are all over the place
- Appalling logistics
The positives. There are occasional sets of glory of single tourists. Greek girls are also very caring if you can hit it off.
Overall, Athens is about taking it on the chin, then out of nowhere things go from 0 to 100 very quickly.
That’s the TLDR, but let’s start unpacking everything.
You are a stranger trying to get in
This summarises the attitude of the Greek girls. Greeks are worry of their outgroup (outside their crew or mini clan) and it is expressed in a variety of ways. The easiest expressions are the two following typical inset responses:
- Girl sparks, laughs, initiates kino herself. Then… just leaves. Why? She is impressed. She really is. Local Greek guys are pushover wooshies; girls learn to manage and dominate social circles (also carrying the bulk of organising work, mind you). So your approach really is the unique Disney moment. But… these things don’t happen in Greece; her outgroup distrust is so strong that it overrides the temporal good feelings. When she leaves, it is not because she dislikes you; it is just that the idea of things continuing into dates and so on is so out of her reality. She literally never thought about it.
- The girl blows you off hard. They won’t be openly rude; they will just ignore your presence and keep on walking (it’s way more common than abroad). This is twofold. One side of it comes from the million intrusive homeless and local petty sellers. The other side is that she has no reason to step out (or is trapped) in her social circle. Greece just works like that.
There are ways to combat some of this. First is calibration, which we will discuss later. Second is speaking in English… if you can pull it off.
Why is it important? It draws her to the English frame. For point 2 girls, it filters out that you are not a pestering seller, albeit you might still be the uncalibrated tourist. But overall, just by speaking a different language, you nullify the local customs. You are dumping them down. Girls are much more social than guys; speaking English means entering the British frame of communication. Street pick-up might be socially allowed there… she probably isn’t sure about this, but this means she will give you a chance to throw your pitch.
The local tourist scene
Welcome to the evergreen city of ancient ruins and history. You would assume that just walking around the Acropolis, you could extend your arms and horny single tourists will fall into you. Well… no, not even close. Athens feels like Trafalgar Square in London. Yes, it is constantly populated, but the demographics are not there.
The tourist scene dictates the daygamable times. The monuments are open to the public until 5pm in winter and until 8pm in the summer. Regardless, the mornings are dominated by tourist groups, couples, and French families that bring even their great-grandparents along for the ride. Needless to say, at this time, sets are nearly non-existent.
Aside regarding couples: do these people live the vacation dream? I genuinely wonder. It’s so common that the girl is walking up to 10m ahead of the guy, I have doubts they like each other. Take your time to make sure the girl is alone. It is not uncommon for the boyfriend to appear out of nowhere.
I believe around 5pm, the tourist groups break off for the day, and the visitors spread out. Accounting for an afternoon siesta, the best timing is from 5.30 onwards. That’s also the time that Greeks get off work, so the demographics are most favourable.
Targeting and calibration
My viewpoint is as follows. Blowouts in Greece can be nasty. It is not worth risking your vibe. Take your time to find the sets you like, the sets that are open to the world, and the sets you have a reason to open. Flipping stones is not the strategy to go here.
Maintain a stoic approach. The variance is so high that the nastiest of the nastiest blowouts can follow up into a set of glory. Greece is about taking it on the chin, and then out of nowhere, things go from 0 to 100 really fast.
The daygame river analogy from Krauser is your best friend. Single tourists and other good sets do exist. Life certainly doesn’t owe you. It will throw them into your path when it throws them. Not when you want to. Observe the street, but don’t expect to open – if there are no sets. In Athens, as in Trafalgar, there usually won’t be sets. It is not uncommon to walk 30 or 40, or 50 minutes between sets. That is ok.
On this note, get some running shoes and leave the boots at home. It is not uncommon to finish a session with 20-25k steps. These are on hard cobblestone, and Athens is quite hilly.
For this section, i highly recommend Thomas Crown’s two posts. On Stoic daygame and London mindsets.
Instant dates not dates
Well, if there is a place where numbers mean jack shit, it is Athens. Think about it:
- For tourists, it is not uncommon to stay for 1 or 2 days here and then leave.
- For locals, Greek girls are world-renowned for their inconsistency and inability to follow a time schedule. Read any Krauser memoir and search for the word “wop”. Even if the number leads to a date, it will be arranged last minute. Don’t be surprised if she turns up 30 minutes or 1 hour late. This is how people operate here. I would even go as far as to say expect this. And certainly don’t expect an apology.
Aside: point 2 is a standard feature of developing and/or non-Western societies. Check “The WEIRDest people in the world” and “The harried leisure class” for more on this.
You can’t do much about either of these points. Expect them and play around them. Personally, I have decided that the number-in-date model is the backup plan. The instant date in SDL is more reliable.
Conveying value
Here is where luck is on our side, lads. As mentioned above, local Greek dudes lack fashion, are uneducated, and they can’t speak properly – they shout at each other. Finally, they operate on loose moralities. I have tried to understand the mindset, but I just can’t. Probably somebody else is controlling his frame, and he rolls over.
This is really good. The barrier to entry to the cool kids club is so low. Just don’t dress like a homeless person, convey some charismatic value, and don’t be stupid. Girls will and do really appreciate this. Sometimes, they are so used to guys being incompetent that they will try to lead the frame for you. I repeat this, they will try to lead the frame for your benefit. Red alert! You won’t see this anywhere else. If it happens, let them. It leads to very fast escalation. I personally had 3 kiss closes in under 30 minutes in instant dates.
Maintaining vibe
Part one of this was covered in calibration and targeting. Part two is dealing with locals.
The two sources of anxiety are a lack of manners and pestering street vendors (mostly in Ermou Street). Greeks don’t follow the lane system when walking the street. It’s even worse when the street itself isn’t big (Monastiraki to Thissio corridor). Expect to bump into people, don’t carry many valuables (especially in Monastiraki), and eventually you will get used to this.
With that out of the way, widespread impoliteness only affects you so long you interact with locals, hence fully in your control to moderate.
Street vendors. You can’t do much about it, just be ready for it. Especially in Ermou, I can count at least 3 times where homeless-esque people interrupted my set to try to sell the girl their stuff. They are not polite at all; they are coming with the intention of provoking a fight. Unless the girl really likes you, so she will blow them off, and you can’t do much. Plan your route accordingly, and don’t sweat a few sets being burned like that.
Positive and Negative
This post might have sounded a bit on the negative side. Quite the contrary, young buck. Keen-eyed readers should have focused on the “conveying value section”, because honestly, this is where the game is at. And the bar is low.
The other topics of this post are mindsets and adaptations to the local scene. You just have to… not mentally shoot yourself in the foot. Follow the rules and you will eat with golden spoons.
On my end, Athens has been by far my most adventurous city.
