It always amazed me, I have seen men, not Players per se – normal men, they meet a girl, and they can have… a conversation! And she would even contribute to that conversation, maybe 50% or more!
Now that is a proposition and a half. Even after being years in Game, I can’t do that. I can’t even do that with men. For me, communication is about:
- Either people listen to me mesmerized, contributing minimally.*
- Or no communication at all.
- The in-between gradations are rare and very context dependent.
[*Light exaggeration, I would say I talk 60-65% overall. Still is a lot]
Given the importance of the Investment phase in the LDM, my words should sound close to heresy to the average Daygamer. Well, it shouldn’t be that way, because the aforementioned style of communication is the one of the public orator, it is highly effective and influential.
I am here to argue my style of communication and give some guidance on it. I think Krauser closely matched that style, but I can’t think of other Daygamers who advocated for it.
Why to talk more
Here is where I will break many of the common narratives of Seduction. Because there is a general confusion that talking means something that it is not, some magical end in itself.
No, no, no… communication, as everything else, is about frame control. Body language is about frame control, and vibe is also about frame control. If people are not advocating on collapsing their body language to be on “equal” terms with the girl… then why do they advocate on collapsing their verbals?
The push-back to talking too much comes from the caricature pseudo-confidence Narcissist. He is self-obsessed, talks too loudly, and gives little breathing room to others. In short, obnoxious. But this is the same as using the well-known body builder caricature to discuss body language: they are so buffed they can’t fit into the door!
Both of these examples are on the extreme side and aim to divert discourse to irrelevancy. Talking, if done right, has real, tangible benefits.
It is easier to control the frame
Whoever is talking more has more time to establish his reality as common ground. This is the basis of frame control.
Establishing your morality (read: frame) first is a tangible advantage, because the responder needs to first push back your position before establishing new ground.
Think of it in an example. We are buddies, and we talk about Maldives. You actually want to talk about Italian food. To do so, you need to 1) close out the discussion on Maldives, 2) find a narrative excuse to pivot to Italian food, 3) establish some ground there, before I can redirect the conversation back to Maldives.
Introduces tempo and agency in the interaction
A side-effect of the above is the concept of tempo coming from Strategy. Usually, in a competitive situation, someone has to assume the role of the “attacker” and the other person the role of the “defender”.
Practically, this means that the “attacker” has choice for his next action, while the “defender” has a lingering need to respond to the attacker’s action before he can freely choose his next move.
Imagine a boxing match, your opponent comes close and throws a punch. At this very moment, you don’t have freedom of choice; you need to dodge or guard the punch. You can’t choose to punch yourself, because you will be knocked out before you can even throw it. Your opponent has tempo, because after the punch, he has a bigger decision space than you.
It sub-communicates Power
Remember our definition of Power, it can be measured by how Party B has to adjust his behaviour to Party A.
Well, then, by discussion above, Tempo, Agency, and Frame all signify Power. To the eyes of the listeners, this manifests as Social Dominance of Confidence.
Who should attempt this
It should be plainly obvious that the fact that only two Daygamers ever advocated for this, Me and Krauser, means that it is not a universal strategy. It is something that is personality-driven. It will also screen some girls out and attract others (usually the introverted and feminine ones).
I will make my case on why I can’t stand “equal” communication, and the reader can assess the fit by proxy on how much the text resonates with his personality.
Equal communication is smokes and mirrors
Remember the example above? The non-Gamer friends that can engage in 50-50 conversations? Well… I spend much time observing them. After a while, I realized how directionless this form of speaking is.
- The discussions didn’t evolve to any depth.
- The range of topics was unfocused, everyone could say whatever he/she wanted.
- It didn’t build anything towards real connection or attraction, because of the above.
In short, this was the female type of communication. Everyone taking turns to speak their mind. All have to speak, and you are not allowed to harshly judge anyone for speaking.
Speaking itself is passive-aggressive because it is a form of indirect attack on status. When you let people rumble, they speak on their status markers. When everything is emotional and personalized, opinions and facts become weapons to showcase allegiance and status.
And this is the point: it dilutes the purpose of connection. When you mix status into words, then a superficial persona is cast above your ID. Your personality itself is a social weapon… it is a layer, not the real thing! You cannot truly connect with the girls because there is a barrier to true communication!
Can you really stand listening to girls?
For real… have you heard women talking? Can you go stand still and listen to branching stories of events and how those make them feel? What is the purpose of the story, you ask? To express their feelings! Not the story itself.
This is not to stereotype (albeit, still ok with me), but it is to show why it feels so insufferable. It does, because it makes the whole thing a zero-sum game. She gets a tangible benefit; you don’t.
When the goal of communication is to express feelings, the expectation is that the listener will sympathize. She gets to direct the emotional direction, and more often than not, they will focus on frustrations and negative feelings. In short:
- You get negativity forced upon you.
- She gets a status boost. She has power over you by imposing the emotional setting.
You lost, she won. That is why venting and rumbling feel so insufferable. You are being duped.
From the bird’s eye view, you have been derailed. Seduction is about win-win interactions. You have been subverted.
How to talk more
Now onto the real stuff, how to talk more. There are some hard principles that should not be violated. This is the distinguishing difference between the insufferable idiot and the calibrated Player.
- The communication is on the listener’s terms.
- Make pauses, Calibrate.
- Redefine Investment.
- Responsibility is on you, more than ever.
The communication is on the listener’s terms
This is one piece of wisdom, from the otherwise trashy book “Surrounded by idiots”. It is doubly important for Daygame.
In short, it means that you are not speaking for yourself. You are speaking for the girl, the listener. You want to talk about Aerodynamics and how airplanes fly… tough luck. If she isn’t into it, drop it.
It comes to frame, remember that a frame (or a frame battle) can be established when both parties are willing to engage. If you don’t make the discussion about her, she won’t engage.
Remember the discussion on tempo. Tempo means freedom of action, but it doesn’t mean absence of responsibility of action. In our boxing example, if after you throw the punch, you decide to drop your hands and stare at the ceiling, then your opponent will floor you. Just because you can decide to withdraw, throw a second punch, or manoeuvre, it doesn’t mean you can do everything and anything.
Make pauses, Calibrate
Just because you talk more, doesn’t mean she shouldn’t talk at all. Give her the chance to engage with pauses. This will let you calibrate on her communications style. She might be more flirty, she might be more passive. You will have to adapt to her. Stop talking and let her speak if it is for the progression of the interaction.
Because you are controlling the course of things, you need to become very sensitive to frame control. You need to know when to pivot topics and when to proceed in the absence of signal. This can come from experience or probing tactics. Pauses and strategic passes to her are the probing tactics.
Redifine investment
Investment is not about who talks anymore. It is about how much more she does for you, over her normal behaviour. If she is an introvert who doesn’t talk much, talking even a little is investment. If she lets some kino, it is a substitute of talking. If she listens attentively and actively on a demanding topic, it is investement.
This ties to a bigger concept, that you should appreciate her effort in general. Her effort is relative to who she is as a person. Not to the established norms. If she doesn’t kiss on the first date, but kisses you, that is big investment and interest. It doesn’t matter you didn’t hook up.
Responsibility is on you, more than ever
Remember the first rule of Agency:
You have freedom of action, but full responsibility of said action
You want control and agency over the interaction… you have to earn it. You have to say interesting things, you have to make her world more colourful.
You want to control the frame? The foundation of frame control is soft power. You need to be worthy for her to want you to lead.
Talking too much is not a blanket strategy because it is easier. It is a harder adaptation we have to resort to because our personalities don’t match other options.
